Used Automation Systems

[LunarMedia]

I'm working with some clients in a small un-rated market that are currently using a VERY OLD DOS based automation system and they are looking to upgrade, but as usual they have little to no money to spend on this project. Is there anywhere I can look/shop for a used automation system like Maestro, SS 32, Prophet Wizard or NexGen, ENCO, etc?

They will need the following capabilities:

1) Voice Tracking: This would need to be a user friendly interface like the modules in SS 32 and Wizard.

2) Sat/Network Integration: 2 stations are on the bird (for the most part), one station is live for 4 hours in the morning.

3) Remote User Capabilities: 3 of the 4 stations run an immense amount of local NCAA D1 althletics and the play by play for the "home games" is done by station employees, they are using board-ops but the staff is thin as it is and the ability to remote control the automation would be ideal, even if that means VPN/VNC.

4) User Friendly Production: The part-time staff are all radio greenhorns, so the easier the better. I prefer NexGen and SS 32's TLC, but beggars can't be choosers.

5) Front office integration: This would be a tremendous upgrade from their current capabilities, right now the traffic director/business manager has to manually merge the traffic logs in each studio as does the PD with the music logs. Plus, integration with both scheduling software packages is vital.

I know Player 101 by RCS/Prophet is perfect for all of these, but it's the required hardware upgrades is cost prohibitive.

If any of you have or know someone who has a "pre-owned" automation system, please reply here. If you know of a resource where they can "shop" for one, please reply here.

Thanks.

[oldiesstation]

Ebay has good deals on older Audioscience cards that would work fine with player 101.i know systems using the older 4300 series all the way up to the 6000 series.check Ebay.

[Rob Stutson]

I think shopping for a complete used system isn't going to be cost-effective. You'll probably be running on hardware that's not a lot newer than what you already have and if it's been running 24/7 it may very well need to be replaced. Plus there's issues with software upgrades/bug fixes that might not be supported on older systems.

Your best bang for your buck is to buy/build some inexpensive PCs with XP (if possible), get some pre-owned sound cards and get a cheap software package like RCS Player101 or BSI Simian. If AudioScience cards are out of budget you can use Echo Gina cards (new about $250) or even Antex LX-44 cards (usually about $50 on eBay).

[LunarMedia]

I wonder how truely stable Simian is...I don't know of many people who use it, although BSI's newest product is used across all of Cumulus exclusively, so I have to imagine they know what they are doing, although isn't BSI owned by Cumulus now?? An engineer friend of mine just suggested Simian to me in the last 10 minutes. Ironic.

And obviously Player 101 is NexGen simplified, but how expensive is it really? I know that the core license isn't too pricey but it's all the add-ons they would need in order to function that may make it out of their range.

Any help?

[oldiesstation]

Call Prophet/RCS.Get them to work a deal.I would take player 101 over simian anyday,especially if you plan on any voicetracking.and simian is owned by cumulus..But it's an ok product.You will love player 101.

[ChiefOperator]

Check out StationPlaylist automation.  I may be perfect for your station, given your small budget. 

www.stationplaylist.com   

[Rob Stutson]

I wonder how truely stable Simian is...I don't know of many people who use it, although BSI's newest product is used across all of Cumulus exclusively, so I have to imagine they know what they are doing, although isn't BSI owned by Cumulus now?? An engineer friend of mine just suggested Simian to me in the last 10 minutes. Ironic.

And obviously Player 101 is NexGen simplified, but how expensive is it really? I know that the core license isn't too pricey but it's all the add-ons they would need in order to function that may make it out of their range.

Any help?

Simian runs fine IF you follow BSI's hardware guidelines (e.g. no dual-core/hyperthreading CPUs and don't use SoundBlaster-grade cards).  IIRC Player101 WILL work fine with Soundblaster-grade cards. As far as price goes you could get the core 101 and the add-ons for about the same as Simian.

StationPlaylist is a nice product but it's in the same family as Jazler, SAM and DRS2006 - good inexpensive apps for Part 15s/LPFMs but try to find any major market stations that use the products. And check the after-hours support options from these companies as they can vary widely. RCS, BSI and other major players make it VERY clear they have 24/7/365 support.

One other thought before you buy: Go to the websites of the systems you're considering and check out the user forums.  That will give you a good picture of what issues current users of the software have been experiencing.

[easyfm]

StationPlaylist is a nice product but it's in the same family as Jazler, SAM and DRS2006 - good inexpensive apps for Part 15s/LPFMs but try to find any major market stations that use the products.

The OP says he's looking on behalf of "a small un-rated market", not a "major market station".

StationPlaylist will do the job fine.

1) Voice Tracking: Yes
2) Sat/Network Integration: Yes
3) Remote User Capabilities: Yes
4) User Friendly Production: Yes
5) Front office integration: Traffic - Yes; Music scheduling - Yes

Doesn't require "cost prohibitive" hardware.

[TomT]

Either you are in business or you are not.  I own two FM's, one suburban to a small rated market, one licensed to a county seat of 5000 with three other local signals. I wouldn't touch anything below the level of Simian or Nexgen.

We've used Simian on two satellite fed FM's for 5 years. No major problems.  I will grant that it is not the easiest to use for voice tracking, but otherwise it is very stable. Your up-front cost is $1500 plus sound card and computer with XP-pro.  Be sure to get an XP-Pro machine--won't work on Vista.  However, you can get
a new computer with adequate RAM and a good size hard drive for under $500.  Look for specials from the on-line retailers.

The low end Audioscience card is about $600. Sounds fine, and Simian can use the software mixer that comes with the card to do smooth segues.  For billing and music scheduling, get the Natural Log and Natural Music programs.  Both programs can be used for more than one station. Natural Log will save hours come time for billing. We're licensed to a city of 2300, in a county of 8400, but we have several hundred invoices to send out each month. A reliable billing program is a necessity to avoid drowning in paperwork.

Finally, sign up for GoToMyPC.  After our veteran ops manager suddenly died, we had to fall back on his second in command, a full-time college student at a university 75 miles away. A cheap XP machine, Mackie mixer and mike allowed him to both program the stations from his college apartment as well as up load weather forecasts and school closings during the week.

[listner1]

I can also vote for Simian for a small market station. I'm actually using the integrated sound card on our machine. Now were satellite, but we can still do overlapping audio in the breaks, it will play wavs or mp3's no problem. We record lots of backround feeds flawlessly. Infact, it trims the silence from the beginning and end of any feeds it records. We are a Dial Global 24/7 affiliate with CNN News, Nascar, Yankee Baseball and various westwood one sports. Siman handles it all with no major issues. The last version is very stable and works great. Interfaces with pretty much any broadcast tools unit, or anything controlled via serial port.

Now it does run best left alone. If you are doing alot of live programming with it, it's not the best. But if you leave the thing run all day on it's own, it works great.

Also a second for Natural Log. Once you take a few hours to play with it and learn it, it's very easy to use, and honestly, seems to work better and has just as many features as Wicks/Deltaflex/CBSI that the big groups are using.

I use VNC and PC Anywhere to control both the on air and traffic systems for the station which is 600 miles away. Have a old Pentium II with windows 2k encoding a shoutcast 48k AAC stream so I can listen to it. I haven't even logged into that machine for over 6 months. It just keeps working!

Also look into the radio spider at www.digitaljukebox.com . It will download any web feeds for you at a schedule you give it, rename them if you want, convert file type if you want, and drop it into your automation. We use this for westwood one feeds and our weather.

Let me also reccomend Radio Forecast Network. 3 min a day of barter, and they provide all of your forecasts. We've been with them 2 years, and they have never missed one forecast. I can't say that about the "accu" guys. Works flawlessly with the Radio Spider software too.