Smooth Jazz Not Dead

[Buckeyes2001]

Was 107.3 the Wave affiliated at all with the now defunct V98.7 up in Detroit? I read that the Wave flipping to AAA had something to do with V98.7 flipping to AMP radio. Any truth to that?

[vjm]

What is  more significant of failure than selling a station with a failed format? Most format flips are enough of a sign of failure. Selling the station, firing the staff, and going back to the original format is evidence of a failed effort.

I guess those Bruce Springsteen bootleg recordings didn't quite get the numbers they were suposed to?   

It'll be fun to see how the return of smooth jazz to this Elyria station performs after the failed AAA experiment.

AAA bombed...no arguements there.

Who was at fault...doesn't matter, as it will be done away with soon enough.

Though portraying 107.3 as an "Elyria station" is selling it short.  They are a full market solid class B signal.  All through the Wave years, they were in the top 10 ratings wise.

And I'll eat my hat if we go back to the all Kenny G and Dave Koz style "smooth jazz" format, and don't get "Smooth AC" (best described as Soft AC/Lite Rock with a dash of R&B).

[vjm]

Was 107.3 the Wave affiliated at all with the now defunct V98.7 up in Detroit? I read that the Wave flipping to AAA had something to do with V98.7 flipping to AMP radio. Any truth to that?

I wouldn't think so.

WNWV was (until now) always locally owned by Elyria-Lorian Broadcasting (ELB), who never owned any stations in Michigan.

Now 107.3 can (during optimum weather conditions) be heard semi-clearly in Detroit, but anything V 98.7 did would be on their own accord, and not really related to 107.3

[Nathan Obral]

Was 107.3 the Wave affiliated at all with the now defunct V98.7 up in Detroit? I read that the Wave flipping to AAA had something to do with V98.7 flipping to AMP radio. Any truth to that?

I wouldn't think so.

WNWV was (until now) always locally owned by Elyria-Lorian Broadcasting (ELB), who never owned any stations in Michigan.

Now 107.3 can (during optimum weather conditions) be heard semi-clearly in Detroit, but anything V 98.7 did would be on their own accord, and not really related to 107.3

ELB did own four stations in Florida between the 1950s and 1980s, during the Paul Nakel era, but that was about it. V98.7 was owned by Infinity Broadcasting (now known as CBS - which continues to own successor station WDZH "AMP."

Most smooth jazz stations shared some sort of branding, but not that much. WNWV itself started out as a 24/7 piped-in satellite format from Metromedia (then-owners of KTWV) which supplied 107.3 with their first logo and the "Wave" name. When they ended carriage of the sattelite format, a royalty dispute with KTWV wound up with WNWV branding itself as "Cleveland's Cool FM: 107.3 WNWV."

That lasted for about 18 months, when a license arrangement was made with KTWV to bring the "Wave" name back. Since then, WNWV had (and apparently still has) exclusivity rights to the "Wave" name - no station in a 60-mile radius can lay claim to it.

AFAIK, V98.7 never used the "Wave" name. But the current WMXD/92.3 in Detroit did back in 1988 when they too piped in the Metromedia KTWV format.

[Capulet]

What is  more significant of failure than selling a station with a failed format? Most format flips are enough of a sign of failure. Selling the station, firing the staff, and going back to the original format is evidence of a failed effort.

 I'm torn between either flaming you, burying you with facts and statistics, or laughing you out of the room with your continuous ignorance.

What's with the personal attack Nathan? Pretty immature.

Facts are facts. WNWV flips to AAA and tanks. Mix 106.5 flips to " We play anything " and kills! 
Go figure.   BTW, Lonnie wasn't programming. Other AAA stations in the country are successful.
There are many formats, and  some good programmers are still working. And there is bad programming that results in format flips when stations are sold.

It will be interesting to see what WNWV puts on the air.  Maybe it won't be smooth jazz. That could be a smoke screen.

[Capulet]

What is  more significant of failure than selling a station with a failed format? Most format flips are enough of a sign of failure. Selling the station, firing the staff, and going back to the original format is evidence of a failed effort.

I guess those Bruce Springsteen bootleg recordings didn't quite get the numbers they were suposed to?   

It'll be fun to see how the return of smooth jazz to this Elyria station performs after the failed AAA experiment.

AAA bombed...no arguements there.

Though portraying 107.3 as an "Elyria station" is selling it short.  They are a full market solid class B signal.  All through the Wave years, they were in the top 10 ratings wise.

The soon to be jetisoned AAA that was on the air was poorly executed by management with no expertise in that format.

You're right. Calling that 107.3  " the Elyria station " is part sarcasm, part city of license! 
As you say they were a top 10 performer for years.

What they put on next will be interesting. The sonic wallpaper Kenny G smooth jazz of the " glory days of The Wave past " might not be the exact format path they tread.

Time will tell.

[AnotherCat]

using the "relax" tagline in 2011 would be the kiss of death with listeners under 55. Smooth A/C is iffy too because it is trusting that there are enough older listeners in the market who think the mainstream a/c is too "hot" and will switch to a softer sounding station. And again even if it gets traction the demos would kill you.

For this to not bleed money from the start there would have to be a reinvention of the approach to programming the music - a mindset that saw it as instrumental oriented adult alternative instead of "smooooooooth" jazz - not a progressive or ultra hip mindset but bringing some life, energy, and entertainment to the mix. Then they might be able to sneak in and carve a niche for 35-54s who are sick of the the 100 songs that A/C stations pound to death and just want a sonic vacation. The catch there is that these folks have probably moved on to streaming music on their mobile devices.

[Tim]

When car radios begin comming in mass with web access...and in-car broadband becomes cheaper....then, the world will change for "radio" stations, terrestrial and streaming.

For now, sure...listening on phones or on computers certainly is being done....but, the rather poor sound quality of tiny speakers on smart phones & most computers, and the additional monthly charges for unlimited mobile broadband is somewhat an inconvience.

[Buckeyes2001]

I found the article from the Plain Dealer from 12/23/09 just before the original 107.3 The Wave flipped to AAA:

http://www.cleveland.com/tv/index.ssf/2009/12/wnwv_the_wave_soon_to_flip_for.html

They claim PPM results are what prompted the format flip...

[Nathan Obral]

BTW, Lonnie wasn't programming.

When Lonnie was insisting on having certain songs played on "The Wave" (even directly to people like Bernie Kimble or Angie Carli, regardless of how they fared in listener testing), I'm sorry, but that's the definition of programming. Isn't it?

That extended throughout the whole "Boom!"/"V" era. Lonnie had direct input into the playlist and kept trying to leave his own mark at the station in accordance with his personal tastes.

He originally insisted upon a hybrid AAA/SJ format to be called "Jaaaz." I'm not kidding.

AND he was hell-bent on the "Boom!" name, in spite of multiple people asking him BEFORE the December 2009 format flip if ELBC had clearance to use it (those people already noticed the classic hits "Boom" in Toronto and CBS's HD-2 "Boom" in Seattle). Those people tried to pitch other names, INCLUDING "The Lake" or "The Peak," but Lonnie refused.

The only reason WNWV took the "V107.3" moniker was because it reminded Lonnie of "Z100."

By a sharp contrast, Lonnie's predecessor at ELBC, Gary Kniesley, was very much hands-off and let the program directors actually do their job. Throughout Gary's tenure, WNWV was in the top 10 overall with a minimum of marketing and word-of-mouth listener-ship.

There are many formats, and  some good programmers are still working. And there is bad programming that results in format flips when stations are sold.

Rubber City could have re-booted the AAA format or reset 107.3 to modern rock. They might have even seriously considered it, for all we know. But it would have come with a totally new air-staff, new management, new programmers.

A total revamp or outright format flip WAS going to happen with this purchase. Period. This was a dead format walking... it had NO chance of survival.