Pandora Still Losing Money

[scanman1]

I listen to the mobile app sometimes on my iphone, and I've noticed many more commercials in the last week.  Sometimes every 2-3 songs.  Not sure if it's after you've listened a certain amount of time they include more, or what.

I can't help but wonder if they'll bring back some kind of limit to free listening at some point.

I can listen for hours on my PC and not hear a single commercial. The difference between the amount of money made on spots played on PC vs. Mobile must be significant! (Someone earlier in the thread pointed out the difference in money made per spot on each platform, I wonder of the difference between the two isn't even larger than those figures state). Anyhow, I hope the listening limit doesn't return, it's the reason I quit using Pandora for a while (returned when the limit was lifted).

[Casey]

Internet radio is still too weak to make much of an impact in the automobile, leaving only broadcast radio which speaks for itself.

This won't be the case in the future, due to tech advances, and even in the near term, streaming via 3G and 4G and plugging into a USB or other means, to a radio in the automobile.

As advances in technology increase, look for other avenues to stream to autos as well. We are. at no means, at the end of the tech bubble.

Currently it is a hassle though. I listen to Slacker in my auto, but it isn't as easy as I would like and I have no doubt many wouldn't bother. Only full integration will allow internet radio to make a strong run at satellite and broadcast radio, and it will take a while before autos with included internet radio are mainstream.



An interesting statistic was released at RAIN today. 90% of all Sound Exchange royalties for 2011 are from Pandora and SiriusXM. The remaining 10% is made up of everyone else. Clear Channel, CBS, all other terrestrial streams, cable radio stations, the 10,000+ streaming stations, etc. It has been estimated for a while that Pandora serves roughly half of all measured internet radio listeners in the USA on an average day. 50% of all streaming plus the cable networks should equal a lot more than 10%. Does anyone else find that a little strange? RAIN doesn't come out and say it, but it looks to me like a lot of people simply are not paying as much as they should if they pay anything at all. This is very damaging to Pandora and internet radio as a whole.

http://kurthanson.com/news/macdonald-%22staggering-figure%22-suggests-pandora-siriusxm-have-%22-good-deal-leverage-extract-fair-

[TheBigA]

RAIN doesn't come out and say it, but it looks to me like a lot of people simply are not paying as much as they should if they pay anything at all.

No that's not true.  Under the terms of the deal made with Congress a couple of years ago, internet broadcasters were able to negotiate different rates.  And Pandora is paying at the highest royalty rate.  Some in their company would want to renegotiate down to the same rate as CC and CBS, but Westergrin doen't like it.  He's proud of the sum his company pays, and says so when he speaks to music industry groups around the country. 

[Casey]

The Pandora SEC filling in 2011 stated that they pay the Pureplay rate for free streams and a higher rate for Pandora One streams. Pandora played a major role in the Pureplay settlement. CBS and Clear Channel do not qualify for this lower rate with their terrestrial streams. Their custom stations services, Last.fm and iHeart (custom channel feature) may qualify.

The SEC filled on 03/19/12 says the same thing. They are not paying the higher CRB rate.

"In July 2009, we elected to be subject to the Pureplay Settlement and timely filed notices of election with SoundExchange for 2010, 2011and 2012. We currently intend to continue to make such elections through 2015."