We have $$ and you HATE us!!!?

[LITTLEBOYBLUE]

With all this chatter about 60's slipping away to banished KIXI-land --- makes me wonder why agencies, buyers etc. seem to be so allergic to the upper demographics?

The irony to me is that once you've got the house paid off, shoved the kids out of the paid-off home, and slowed down a bit you're left with a heap of .... DISPOSABLE INCOME.  That would SEEM to be something that would get the attention of people who want you to spend your ... DISPOSABLE INCOME..??

djdan .... why do your clients seem to want us off their Christmas (oops...I mean HOLIDAY) card lists???

[It is frustrating watching upper-demos shows on TV where the only ads you see are for scooters, Medical insurance, etc. --- there are some people who are a BIT younger than that, but seems that's the primary advertiser group on some of these shows...??]

[Rob Stutson]

> With all this chatter about 60's slipping away to banished
> KIXI-land --- makes me wonder why agencies, buyers etc. seem
> to be so allergic to the upper demographics?
>

Because study after study shows that upper-demos - while holding a lot of disposable income - don't make buying decisions based on advertising only.  So why should an advertiser place dollars where it does the least good?

And yes - some older folks may own an iPod, drive a Scion and wear the newest fashions - but it's not SOLELY because of a slick ad campaign.

[AQH]

It's also a "generational" thing.  Those folks were just coming out of The Great Depression era, a time when saving their money was not being a penny-pincher, but essential.  Then you transition over to the "can't teach an old dog new tricks" saying.

Boomers, Tweeners and Xers will likely be more willing to spend their money.  That's IF they saved their money.

[ttmatson]

> Because study after study shows that upper-demos - while
> holding a lot of disposable income - don't make buying
> decisions based on advertising only.  So why should an
> advertiser place dollars where it does the least good?
>
> And yes - some older folks may own an iPod, drive a Scion
> and wear the newest fashions - but it's not SOLELY because
> of a slick ad campaign.
>

Nope you're right about those items - BUT - we do BUY RV's, Vacation Homes, Enjoy Fine Dining, Plays / Arts / Events, High End Electronics, etc. So maybe "if" the sales departments re-adjusted their thinking and started to do their job and prospect those type of companies instead of going after the "easy" sell, i.e., advertisers already onthe air - they would find the ad $$$ to support the radio those of us with a "more mature" taste have - we do supporrt businesses that provide us a service we desire. Plus advertising does inform us of oour local options - just a thought.

[Daniel_Mann]

We used to say that all of the media buyers were 25 year old women just out of college. They only bought what they could understand. However, I think it's something entirely different these days.

Could it be that aging closes our minds to advertising and the agency's have discovered this in their research? That would make it an efficiency argument. :30 or :60 seconds is not enough time to get a message through age barrier.

I'd love to hear djdan's take but here's mine. It's an age bias. People 50 and above have their heads so confused with 40 years of absorbing messages that it's harder to put in a positive message for a new product.

I tend to believe that most people over 50 have already made up their minds on the brands they are loyal too and therefore are a segment that's harder to convince. Also, many of the things aimed at youth just don't work for older people and their health problems. Coke/Pepsi vs adult onset diabetes for instance. They've already decided they like Safeway over Albertsons. They will always buy their Ford from the same dealer. They hate the new music their kids listen to. They're not sitting on the edge of their seat reading people magazine. Their distrust of new ideas (as proven in political seasons) keeps rising to absurd heights. They don't want to take anymore chances and get burned, etc.

I think there's a fear based approach that seems to be prevalent towards 50 somethings. What if you don't have the correct medical coverage, the best hospital for your illness, the money to buy an electric wheel chair, that candidate is going to steal all of your medicines and laugh at stupid you,  what if your grand kids don't love YOOOOOUUUUU!

Hmm... cool versus fear...

It takes more exposure to have an effect with a negative message so it may be simply an efficiency of exposure thing. It costs too much for a decent result with the 50 plus crowd.

[Daniel_Mann]

Your list is all local advertising sources. The folks who have to be convinced to market on radio. The lowest on the food chain. Stations make the bulk of their money from national agency buys. Consolidation was supposed to help stations target the national buys. Consolidation will control whether the older formats stay on the air based on the national buys they receive. There's no way that your list of potential clients can pay the bills of a radio station.

 
> Nope you're right about those items - BUT - we do BUY RV's,
> Vacation Homes, Enjoy Fine Dining, Plays / Arts / Events,
> High End Electronics, etc. So maybe "if" the sales
> departments re-adjusted their thinking and started to do
> their job and prospect those type of companies instead of
> going after the "easy" sell, i.e., advertisers already onthe
> air - they would find the ad $$$ to support the radio those
> of us with a "more mature" taste have - we do supporrt
> businesses that provide us a service we desire. Plus
> advertising does inform us of oour local options - just a
> thought.
>

[The Original Larry]

> It's also a "generational" thing.  Those folks were just
> coming out of The Great Depression era, a time when saving
> their money was not being a penny-pincher, but essential.
> Then you transition over to the "can't teach an old dog new
> tricks" saying.
>
> Boomers, Tweeners and Xers will likely be more willing to
> spend their money.  That's IF they saved their money.

Don't you see they can't save money because they ARE willing to spend it. And a lot of that is social pressure and Madison Avenue encouraging more spending (What?-like they would want you to SAVE your money? Are you now or have you ever been a member of the Communist party?)

But seriously, folks today were never brought up with the same sort of prudence my grandma's generation had. Usually, what is considered "disposable income" today would have been saved in the 1940s. But today, all forms of advertising bombard people with the message "You MUST have THIS." Not "You don't need this right now..c'mon, save up!". Everybody wants your credit card number. Some people were never taught how to save money.

And if you're in advertising, you are not going to target the penny pinching grandma. You want the spoiled rotten grandkid who blows it all away.

Middle class jobs with families to support don't pay much either these days after cost of living and paying the wealthy's share of taxes on top of your own, so "disposable income" is pretty much a dated '90s term for a lot of people.
>

______________
"If I were in this business only for the business, I wouldn't be in this business." Samuel Goldwyn

theoriginallarry@graffiti.net

[AQH]

> Don't you see they can't save money because they ARE willing
> to spend it. And a lot of that is social pressure and
> Madison Avenue encouraging more spending (What?-like they
> would want you to SAVE your money? Are you now or have you
> ever been a member of the Communist party?)

Who cares what "they" want?  In your world, it's everyone else's fault --  Madison Avenue for promoting and marketing products and Clear Channel for bringing in hard drives and voicetracking.  You probably blame the guy at the grocery store for leaving dairy products in your fridge too long, don't you?

I will give you the fact that the people who grew up just after The Great Depression didn't have things like iPods, cell phones and SUVs.  

But let me ask you this...when does personal responsibility come into play?  Let's stop blaming everyone else for a change and let's take some personal accountability for a moment.  

Just like it's your choice on which radio stations to listen to, there are no guns pointed at peoples' heads to purchase things and overspend.  And the "The Greatest Generation" as Tom Brokaw calls them, HAS personal accountabilty and discipline.  That's the difference.

[TeeTaw]

> > Don't you see they can't save money because they ARE
> willing
> > to spend it. And a lot of that is social pressure and
> > Madison Avenue encouraging more spending (What?-like they
> > would want you to SAVE your money? Are you now or have you
>
> > ever been a member of the Communist party?)
>
> Who cares what "they" want?  In your world, it's everyone
> else's fault --  Madison Avenue for promoting and marketing
> products and Clear Channel for bringing in hard drives and
> voicetracking.  You probably blame the guy at the grocery
> store for leaving dairy products in your fridge too long,
> don't you?
>
> I will give you the fact that the people who grew up just
> after The Great Depression didn't have things like iPods,
> cell phones and SUVs.  
>
> But let me ask you this...when does personal responsibility
> come into play?  Let's stop blaming everyone else for a
> change and let's take some personal accountability for a
> moment.  
>
> Just like it's your choice on which radio stations to listen
> to, there are no guns pointed at peoples' heads to purchase
> things and overspend.  And the "The Greatest Generation" as
> Tom Brokaw calls them, HAS personal accountabilty and
> discipline.  That's the difference.

Bravo Larry, Bravo!


>

[KlunkLetter]

> With all this chatter about 60's slipping away to banished
> KIXI-land --- makes me wonder why agencies, buyers etc. seem
> to be so allergic to the upper demographics?
>
> The irony to me is that once you've got the house paid off,
> shoved the kids out of the paid-off home, and slowed down a
> bit you're left with a heap of .... DISPOSABLE INCOME.  That
> would SEEM to be something that would get the attention of
> people who want you to spend your ... DISPOSABLE INCOME..??
>
> djdan .... why do your clients seem to want us off their
> Christmas (oops...I mean HOLIDAY) card lists???
>
> [It is frustrating watching upper-demos shows on TV where
> the only ads you see are for scooters, Medical insurance,
> etc. --- there are some people who are a BIT younger than
> that, but seems that's the primary advertiser group on some
> of these shows...??]
>
Go to the "Oldies" board, there is more discussion on this subject.