"HD DOA"

[Chuck]

These are two small market radio stations. They are hardly state of the art operations. You can't compare a 500 watt daytimer on 1410 or a local 1K on 1240 with the station that are currently just implimenting IBOC. I'll bet neither stations has a Telos Zephyr X-Stream or a Comrex Hotline or any of what is today considered standard broadcast equipment for a larger radio station. Here's some station info about KRML. Not exactly major market (remember major markets are where more people live) income. I'm sure it serves its nice community, but you don't base an industry decision on 2 small market facilities.

II guess you've never spent any time in Carmel or Monterrey.  I sure have. In fact, I actually know some people who live there.  If you visit, bring money.  Bring lots of it.  By design, there are not a ton of people who live in Carmel, but those who do enjoy one of the nicest places in the world. Monterrey, next door, is a decent size town.  Pebble Beach Golf Course lies between the two. To say it is a “high rent” district would be a gross understatement.  I assure you that there are "enough" people to support a lot of high end businesses and most of the people who live there are very affluent.  Starting price for an entry level one bedroom shack in the area is well over a half million dollars. My friends purchased a two bedroom home for $2.5 million. That was ten years ago.  Now it's worth about $10, million, maybe more. There are a lot of homes in the area that sell for many times that amount.

I'm sure that KRML is doing just fine.  There AM stereo signal sounds excellent.  The first time I heard it (it was in a restaurant) I thought they were FM. I doubt that they give a rats a** about Telos Zephyrs or Comrex Hotlines.  Why would they? Just owning a lot of equipment doesn’t make a great station.  It’s what you do with what you’ve got that counts.  If what they are doing works well for them, I say more power to them.

[Chuck]

I had a nice conversation with owner Dave Kimball and he said that since going online a couple of years ago that they have been getting listeners from all across the country.  I didn't ask him for a listener count but Dave is excited enough about the potential of webcasting that he is in the process of beefing up his servers to allow for more streams.

db

Although there may not be big numbers for Internet broadcasting as yet, it is a developing market.  Even my little station in Chalk Hill, Texas gets its hare of people dropping by to see what is going on.  Here is a partial list of the locations people have taken the time to email us from:

The Village of Henri-Chappelle, Belgium -  Pasadena, Maryland - McKinnon, Tennessee - Kansas City, Missouri - Westerville, Ohio -  El Paso, Texas  Spartanburg, South Carolina - Macaeo, Rio De Janero, Brazil - Los Angeles, California - Threemilestone, Truro, Cornwall, UK - Yucca Valley, California Hopewell, Virginia - Boulder City, Nevada - Flint, Michigan - Alma, Georgia  Waxahachie, Texas - Charlottesville, Virginia - Mumbai, India - Spring, Texas Troy, Ohio - Laval, Quebec, Canada - Alexandria, Louisiana - Oakridge, Oregon Valkeakoski, Finland - Los Angeles, CA - Anderson, Indiana - Plentywood, Montana - Canmore, Alberta, Canada - Jefferson, Texas - San Diego, CA - Beaumont, Texas - Wisbech Cambridgeshire, UK - Overschild, The Netherlands  San Jacinto, CA - Vero Beach, Florida - Greenfield, Indiana - Lincoln, Nebraska  Tatum, Texas - St. Albert, Alberta, Canada - Milan, Italy - Zagreb, Croatia Clinton Township, Michigan - Hayward California - Durango, Mexico    Thermopolis, Wyoming - Macon, Georgia - Dublin, Ireland - Henderson, Kentucky Pensacola, Florida - Heppner, Oregon - Wellington, New Zealand -Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada - Lone Star, Texas - Tiel, Netherlands - Ardmore, Oklahoma - Castroville, Texas -San Marino, California - Campinas, Sao Paulo, Brazil - Norfolk, Virginia - Grand Prairie, Texas - Sacramento, California - Fairfax, Virginia - White Oak, Texas - Brisbane, Queensland, Australia - Shreveport, Louisiana - Marengo, Indiana - Whyalla, South Australia - Fort Ashby, West Virginia - San Rafael, California - Gettysburg, PA - Port Arthur, Texas - Tainan, Taiwan - Mt. Holly, North Carolina - Bloomfield, New York - York, South Carolina Tampa, Florida -Beaver Falls, Pennsylvania - Shreveport, Louisiana - Hogeye, Arkansas - San Diego, California - Adelaide, South Australia - Melbourne, Australia - Stratford, Connecticut - Madison, Mississippi - Crestview, Florida  Birmingham, UK - Northridge, California - Canyon County, California - Mena, Arkansas - Sacramento, California - Kountze, Texas - Sao Paulo, Brazil - Arlington, Virginia - Silver Springs, Maryland - Lewisville, Texas - Dry Prong, Louisiana - Kantana, Ontario, Canada - Springfield, Illinois - Friendswood, Texas  Wyong, New South Wales, Australia - Mentor, Ohio - Meridian, Mississippi  Leidschendam, The Netherlands - Santa Ana, California - Rusk, Texas - Medicine Hat, Alberta, Canada - Marion, Indiana - Jacksonville, Florida - Boqueron, Puerto Rico - Georgetown, Texas- Vero Beach, Florida - Exeter, New Hampshire - Sioux Falls, South Dakota - Ninilchik, Alaska - Stamford, Connecticut - Tauranga, New Zealand - Wilkes Barre, PA - Marshall, Texas - Berkshire, United Kingdom  Houston, Texas - New Richmond, Wisconsin - Sherman, Texas - Yorkville, Illinois Eden Hills, South Australia - Alexandria, Virginia - Redditch, Worcestershire, UK  Virginia Beach, Virginia - Sydney, Australia - Port Augusta, South Australia  Southfield, Michigan - Plano, Texas - Johnson City, TN - Mesquite, Texas  Moreno Valley, California - Topeka, Kansas - Newport, Oregon - Szekszard City, South Hungary - Boise, Idaho - Pittsburgh, PA - Slusovice, Czech Republic, Europe - Princeton, New Jersey - Walpole, MA - Evansville, Indiana - Bath, Maine Garland, Texas - Ft. Lauderdale, Florida - Woking, Surrey, England - Falun, Sweden - Greenville, SC - Tyler, Texas - Morrow, Georgia - St. Louis, MO  Wichita Falls, Texas - Alpharetta, Georgia - Paradise, Florida - Indianapolis, Indiana - Cincinnati, Ohio - Arp, Texas - Lexington, Kentucky - Tulsa, Oklahoma Mainz, Germany - Chichester, West Sussex, England - Birmingham, Alabama  Dallas, Texas - Cardiff, South Wales - Sisters, Oregon - Honolulu, Hawaii - Fort Worth, Texas - Minneapolis, Minnesota - Longview, Texas - Columbus, Ohio  Kilgore, Texas - Olso, Norway - Atlanta Georgia - Carthage, Texas - Ore City, Texas - Budapest, Hungary - Houston, Texas - San Diego, California - Stockport UK - Lake Cherokee, Texas - Manchester, UK - Hallsville, Texas - Easton, Texas London, England (UK) - Cleveland, Texas - Orlando, Florida - Gladewater, Texas Verona, Italy - Tyler, Texas - Washington, DC - Arlington, Texas  Baltimore, MD Mineral Wells, Texas - Rugby, UK - Collins, New York - Austin, Texas - Chalk Hill, Texas - Des Plains, Illinois - Chicago, Illinois - Providence, Rhode Island - Detroit, Michigan - Franklin, North Carolina - Livingston, Louisiana - WaKeeney, Kansas  West Allis, Wisconsin - Wilmington, Massachusetts  Weatherford, Texas - White Oak, Texas - Temple, Texas - Austin, Texas  Wemberly, Texas - Des Plaines, IL Philadelphia, PA - Tatum, Texas - Overton, Texas - Framingham, Massachusetts Princeton, Texas - Efrat, Israel - Nampa, Idaho -  Etten-Leur, Netherland - Princeton, Texas - Budapest, Hungary - Manhattan, Kansas -Jupiter, Florida -Rolling Hills Estates, California - St. Paul, Minnesota - Brea, California - Roswell, Georgia - St. Augustine, Florida - Columbus, Ohio - New Gloucester, Maine - Silver Spring, Maryland - Ponchatoula, Louisiana - Richmond, Virginia - Penang, Malaysia - Anderson, Indiana - Deltona, Florida - Santa Maria, California - Westerville, Ohio - Prague, Czech Republic - Nampa, Utah -Goat Hills, Czech Republic - Los Angeles, California - Galesburg, IL -Onalaska, Texas - Akron, Ohio - Squamish, B.C. Canada - Pasadena, California - St. Petersburg, Florida - Perrysburg, Ohio - Stamford, Connecticut - Greenville, South Carolina - Flushing, New York - Louisville, Kentucky - Carmel, Indiana - Deltona, Florida - Athens, Greece - Liawa, Poland - Spokane, Washington - Bonita Springs, Florida - London, Ontario, Canada - BP Gulf of Mexico Deepwater Oil Rig - Cincinnati, Ohio - Okinawa, Japan - Montgomery, Alabama - York, South Carolina - Hurricane, West Virginia - Warsaw, Poland - Brinkley, Arkansas - Victoria, British Columbia, Canada -  Fircrest, Washington - Portland, Oregon, - Gladewater, Texas - Ponca City, Oklahoma - Modesto, California - St. Augustine, Florida - San Antonio, Texas - Cologne, Germany- Stansted, UK - Myrtle Beach South Carolina - Wilmington, North Carolina - London, Ontario, Kirkenes, Norway- Townsville, Queensland, Australia - Belvidere, Illinois - Eastleigh, Hampshire, UK - Sanford, Florida -Oostende, Belgium - Brenham, Texas- Los Banos, California - Framingham, Massachusetts - Bonita Springs, Florida - Cincinnati, Ohio - Columbus, Georgia - Bay Town, Texas - Las Vegas, Nevada -Lincoln, Nebraska - Lutz, Florida - Forrest Lake, Queensland, Australia - Massillon, Ohio- Taipei, Taiwan -  Modesto, California - North Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada - Downers Grove, Illinois - Austin, Texas - Nampa, Idaho - Sierra Vista, Arizona - Grand Blanc, Michigan - Stratford on Avon, England - Blackpool, Lancashire, UK - Mexico City, Mexico - New Hudson, Michigan - Robina, Gold Coast, Australia - Richmond, Virginia -Belton, Texas -Belvidere, Illinois - Charlestown, Indiana - Simi Valley, California - Sao Paulo, Brazil - Green Bay, Wisconsin - Little Rock, Arkansas - Clearfield, Pennsylvania - Jamison, Pennsylvania - Lemon Grove, California - Hart, Michigan - Bangor, Northern Ireland, UK - Memphis, Tennessee - Horn Lake Mississippi - Hibbing, Minnesota -"The Bog Apple" New York City, New York - Punxsutawney, Pennsylvania - White Plains, New York  - Batesville, Arkansas -Penang, Malaysia - Merced, California - Hauppauge, New York - Colorado Springs, Colorado- Universal City, California - Casper, Wyoming - Virginia Beach, Virginia -Toronto, Ontario, Canada - Kenosha, Wisconsin - Iraq, exact location can't be disclosed, but he's one of our guys in the service - Richmond, Virginia - Orlando, Florida - Melbourne, Florida - Palm Coast, Florida - Durham, North Carolina - Staten Island, New York - Paradise, Florida - Temecula, California - Roanoke, Virginia -Fairfield, Iowa - Evansville, Indiana - Naples, Texas - Ausburg, Germany - Glen Allen, Virginia -Austin, Texas -York, South Carolina - Charlotte, North Carolina - Washington, DC - Wichita Kansas - Addison, Texas - Canton Texas - Los Alamos, New Mexico - Paso Robles, California - Kuala Lumpur, Maylasia - Miami, Florida - Lexington, Kentucky - Brooklyn, New York - Kingwood, Texas - Rome, Italy - Beaver Falls, Pensylvania - Ankeny, Iowa - Las Vegas, Nevada - Houston, Texas - Tyler, Texas

Those emails are not my imagination.

[radiopilot]

There are tens of thousands of internet radio stations. And the average number of simultaneous listeners for any one station is under TEN. Don't take my word for it, brouse Shoutcast http://www.shoutcast.com and pay particular attention to how many are LISTENING to the stations.

People probably "google" internet radio for the same reason I do...TO FIND STATIONS! There's no such reason to google HD Radio, because the statons are OVER THE AIR, not online. People search more often ONLINE for a service only offered ONLINE. HUGE surprise, thanks for that!

Mike,

You mentioned at any given time less than ten people are listening simultaneously at any given internet radio station, I'd have to disagree with you... Here is SkyFM and if you look at each webcast of the different music categories you can see how many is listening at each station and this is just SkyFM and there are thousands of these websites each getting anywhere between 100's - 10;s of thousands of listeners simultaneously!

http://www.sky.fm/

Enjoy....

Radiopilot

[dumber than a box of hair]

There are tens of thousands of internet radio stations. And the average number of simultaneous listeners for any one station is under TEN. Don't take my word for it, brouse Shoutcast http://www.shoutcast.com and pay particular attention to how many are LISTENING to the stations.

Mike,

You mentioned at any given time less than ten people are listening simultaneously at any given internet radio station, I'd have to disagree with you...

No, that isn't what he said.  Try READING it.  Note particularly the qualifying term "average."

[radiopilot]

These are two small market radio stations. They are hardly state of the art operations. You can't compare a 500 watt daytimer on 1410 or a local 1K on 1240 with the station that are currently just implimenting IBOC. I'll bet neither stations has a Telos Zephyr X-Stream or a Comrex Hotline or any of what is today considered standard broadcast equipment for a larger radio station. Here's some station info about KRML. Not exactly major market (remember major markets are where more people live) income. I'm sure it serves its nice community, but you don't base an industry decision on 2 small market facilities.

II guess you've never spent any time in Carmel or Monterrey.  I sure have. In fact, I actually know some people who live there.  If you visit, bring money.  Bring lots of it.  By design, there are not a ton of people who live in Carmel, but those who do enjoy one of the nicest places in the world. Monterrey, next door, is a decent size town.  Pebble Beach Golf Course lies between the two. To say it is a “high rent” district would be a gross understatement.  I assure you that there are "enough" people to support a lot of high end businesses and most of the people who live there are very affluent.  Starting price for an entry level one bedroom shack in the area is well over a half million dollars. My friends purchased a two bedroom home for $2.5 million. That was ten years ago.  Now it's worth about $10, million, maybe more. There are a lot of homes in the area that sell for many times that amount.

I'm sure that KRML is doing just fine.  There AM stereo signal sounds excellent.  The first time I heard it (it was in a restaurant) I thought they were FM. I doubt that they give a rats a** about Telos Zephyrs or Comrex Hotlines.  Why would they? Just owning a lot of equipment doesn’t make a great station.  It’s what you do with what you’ve got that counts.  If what they are doing works well for them, I say more power to them.

Chuck...

You are so correct on the AM quality sound some stations can broadcast... I was driving from New Port Richey, FL. back to Savannah Friday and I happen to turn on the AM band and scan the channel, I was around Ocala when I happened to get 1030 WONQ... it's a Spanish station (Puerto Rican owned I believe?) Florida Broadcasters out of the Orlando area...  anyway all they play is music with a nostalgic flare for tunes of the past (Spanish) and honestly they BLEW me away... the quality of this broadcast rivaled that of the FM dial... I don't know what processing they have but I riveted to this station until the coverage went fuzzy somewhere around Brunswick, GA.

I quickly looked them up and the offices are in Cassleberry, FL.

If I get a chance I will visit their studios for a looksie and meet the station owners and engineers and see their setup... unbelieveable since in this day and age they want to bring down the bandwidth to 5khz., that would be crazy!

California real estate including Seattle have gone off the charts, I lived in Palos Verdes back in 1970 with my sister for two years and it was expensive then, now you can't touch the real estate there like you say... Bring tons of cash!

Radiopilot

[Mike Walker]

I've got to thank "Dumber" for coming to my defense on this one. I didn't say that no internet stations have large audiences. That would just be a stupid statement. As for SkyFM and Chuck's Chalk Hill station, I AM AMONG YOUR LISTENERS. Good job! What I said was that MOST internet stations have hardly any listeners...AVERAGING ten or less. The most successful internet streams often originate from "real" over-the-air stations, simply because, shock and horror, BROADCASTERS FREQUENTLY KNOW MORE ABOUT BUILDING AN AUDIENCE than the guy down the block who's "shoutcasting" from his basement. And no, I don't mean that there's anything wrong with "shoutcasting" from your basement! God bless you! Put something interesting on, and I'LL LISTEN!

Because I support HD, many see malice in my words when I talk about internet and satellite radio...malice that DOES NOT EXIST! I subscribe to XM. I subscribe to "Urge", "Napster", "Rhapsody", and "Live 365 Premium". I love internet radio enough TO PAY FOR IT, and have subscribed to various internet services through the years. I listen mostly when I'm at my keyboard, or in my studio. But when I'm in my recliner, or listening in bed while I read a good mystery...I've got an HD station "in my cans". As I've said before, "let all flowers bloom". It's ALL good!

[PocketRadio]

I listen mostly when I'm at my keyboard, or in my studio. But when I'm in my recliner, or listening in bed while I read a good mystery...I've got an HD station "in my cans". As I've said before, "let all flowers bloom". It's ALL good!

“RW Opinion: Rethinking AM’s future”

“Making AM-HD work well as a long-term investment is seen as an expensive and risky challenge for most stations and their owners. There is the significant downside of potential new interference to some of their own AM analog listeners as well as listeners of adjacent-channel stations.”

http://www.rwonline.com/pages/s.0044/t.557.html

It's all good ?

[Chuck]

I've got to thank "Dumber" for coming to my defense on this one. I didn't say that no internet stations have large audiences. That would just be a stupid statement. As for SkyFM and Chuck's Chalk Hill station, I AM AMONG YOUR LISTENERS. Good job! What I said was that MOST internet stations have hardly any listeners...AVERAGING ten or less. The most successful internet streams often originate from "real" over-the-air stations, simply because, shock and horror, BROADCASTERS FREQUENTLY KNOW MORE ABOUT BUILDING AN AUDIENCE than the guy down the block who's "shoutcasting" from his basement. And no, I don't mean that there's anything wrong with "shoutcasting" from your basement! God bless you! Put something interesting on, and I'LL LISTEN!

Because I support HD, many see malice in my words when I talk about internet and satellite radio...malice that DOES NOT EXIST! I subscribe to XM. I subscribe to "Urge", "Napster", "Rhapsody", and "Live 365 Premium". I love internet radio enough TO PAY FOR IT, and have subscribed to various internet services through the years. I listen mostly when I'm at my keyboard, or in my studio. But when I'm in my recliner, or listening in bed while I read a good mystery...I've got an HD station "in my cans". As I've said before, "let all flowers bloom". It's ALL good!

Oh, I didn’t take it in any negative way, and I hope you didn't interpret my post that way either.  It is true that most Internet stations don't have a lot of listeners.  There are plenty poking along with one or two, or even no listeners. Those zeros really have a way of making those averages go down.   

Our station doesn't have that many Internet listeners.  You certainly couldn’t make a living off of them.  They are mostly found during week days when people listen at work.  We've also had decent listenership during special local sporting events when friends and family of the teams are interested in tuning in.  A normal week day for us is 35-40 listeners at any given time.  The most I've ever seen at a single time was 75.  They generally listen for 2 or 3 hours at a session, so that would mean around 100-120 people tune in every 8-9 hour work day.  There is no way to tell if they are unique listeners, or someone coming back and logging on after their lunch break. At night, the numbers go down, but it is likely that on average maybe 200 people tune us in every day via the Internet.  Perhaps it is a little more. It depends on how good you are at reading tea leaves. 

For us, it certainly isn't big numbers, but some stations literally do have thousands tuned in.  I doubt any of this is an imminent threat to terrestrial radio.  Even so, for every person listening on the Internet, it is one less person listening off the air. As Mike points out, some of the better Internet stations are terrestrial stations as well, so for them, it is an added bonus. 

None the less, If RIAA doesn't completely kill it, I believe Internet broadcasting has an increasing place in our lives.  And that is good.

[Mike Walker]

By the way, Pocket...I have never said that AM HD was great. My "jury is still out", and will be UNTIL I HAVE SOME PRACTICAL EXPERIENCE WITH IT! Imagine that, waiting until I actually LISTEN WITH MY OWN EARS, IN MY OWN HOME to make up my mind!

[Mike Walker]

Quick guys, go check Google Trends for "socks". You'll probably conclude nobody wears them!