HDTV Reception Question

[Skynet74]

If you are getting WSBK-DT, you should be easily getting most of the other Boston digitals.
WSBK-DT transmits from a common antenna with WBZ-DT, WCVB-DT, and WGBX-DT.
All four use the exact same antenna and are very close in DT channel assignments
(39, 30, 20, 43 respectivley). So I'm curious is something else is causing your lack of reception.
(Front end overload, bad tuner section, local interference... ?)

How about the Providence and nearby stations?

   WSBK comes in clearer on analog than any other Boston station. WHDH and WGBH are a close second. Followed by WCVB and then WBZ. WLVI is snowy and WFXT isn't being received on Analog at all. So I could understand if I couldn't get FOX 25's digital signal. That would make sense to me. But seeing that I pick up the Analog on all the other stations, I would expect to be able to receive the digital signal as well.

 I get the following digital from Providence. WPRI, WJAR and WEATHER PLUS from them too. I also get WLNE in digital as well as WSBE. I do not get WLWC in digital, nor do I get Channel 69 (ION) in digital either. They just won't come in. I moved the antenna cable around a couple of times and the TV didn't pick up WLNE's digital signal even though I had a clear picture of the analog.

 So considering all this data and all of the testing that I did, it just seems to me that my TV does not want to provide a digital picture unless I'm getting a perfect analog signal. This sucks because I was looking forward to getting a crystal clear picture of all the Boston stations that my cable company does not carry. However I'm not giving up yet. I will screw with some more settings later and see if I can make this work.

[Scott Fybush]

Skynet...

It's important to remember that the DTV signals are completely separate from the analog, so it's not a given that being able to get WXXX analog means you will be able to see WXXX-DT, or vice versa.

There are a bunch of factors at play here, including transmitter location (WLNE-DT and WSBE-DT are at transmitter sites far distant from their analog counterparts, for instance), power levels (not all "interim" digital signals are operating at full power), directional patterns and co- and adjacent-channel interference.

For instance, from over here in Rochester (NY, not MA!), I get a rock-solid picture from WSYT-DT 19 Syracuse, some 65 miles east of me. I get no picture at all from WNYS-DT 44, which operates at the same power level from the same site. As best I can figure it out, the problem is a combination of a different directional pattern on the WNYS-DT antenna and the presence, less than a mile away, of local WROC-DT on channel 45, just up the dial.

In your case, it could be WSBE-DT on 21 wreaking havoc with WCVB-DT on 20, just to offer one example.

It also sounds as though you just simply don't have very much signal level from the Route 128 tower farm to begin with (snowy analog signals), in which case you MIGHT benefit from a higher-gain outdoor antenna with a preamp. My experience so far with preamps on digital UHF is that they're not always the best solution, especially if you're near local signals that can overload them.

[Skynet74]

 At this point the only thing I can think of that even makes sense is that the Digital transmissions arn't as strong as the Analog. So I am trying to find out if anyone has experienced similar problems with this TV or it's tuner, but so far I'm not finding a whole lot of information. What can someone tell me about the power output of the digital signals in the Boston area. Are they all operating at full power?

[Skynet74]

I've researched the problem further. Some people who own this set report similar problems. It seems like it might not have the best tuner in the world. It's not sensitive enough.

[FRM-Yankey]

Most older TV antennas are combo's and most DTV is on UHF. I'm not a reception pro but I think U lose something on the UHF stations with the combo antennas.  Maybe a UHF only antenna may do the trick for fringe UHF DTV reception.  But as KML indicates, it's all about the topography.  I would think if U can get the weaker Boston FM's at your location, you'll have no problem that can't be overcome.
[/quote]

As they say in a realtor language location location location, that is also the best for receiving OTA TV signals especially HDTV.
As indicated in some of these posting the FCC has allocated most HDTV signals on the UHF band and unless you have a host of directional focus antennas its almost impossible (in most areas) to get all the OTA HDTV signals with the best of % reception.
I had the same situation here living on the plateaus of the Blue Mt. range in VA. until i found an antenna that solves most of my problems. I found this online under HDTV reception, its called a Xium parabolic with reflective ground, its a little pricey but works. Enclosed is the web address with all the info. if interested.
[url]
www.goxium.com]

Most older TV antennas are combo's and most DTV is on UHF. I'm not a reception pro but I think U lose something on the UHF stations with the combo antennas.  Maybe a UHF only antenna may do the trick for fringe UHF DTV reception.  But as KML indicates, it's all about the topography.  I would think if U can get the weaker Boston FM's at your location, you'll have no problem that can't be overcome.

As they say in a realtor language location location location, that is also the best for receiving OTA TV signals especially HDTV.
As indicated in some of these posting the FCC has allocated most HDTV signals on the UHF band and unless you have a host of directional focus antennas its almost impossible (in most areas) to get all the OTA HDTV signals with the best of % reception.
I had the same situation here living on the plateaus of the Blue Mt. range in VA. until i found an antenna that solves most of my problems. I found this online under HDTV reception, its called a Xium parabolic with reflective ground, its a little pricey but works. Enclosed is the web address with all the info. if interested.
www.goxium.com    [/url]

[w9wi]

At this point the only thing I can think of that even makes sense is that the Digital transmissions arn't as strong as the Analog. So I am trying to find out if anyone has experienced similar problems with this TV or it's tuner, but so far I'm not finding a whole lot of information. What can someone tell me about the power output of the digital signals in the Boston area. Are they all operating at full power?

Most of them are.  The only exceptions I'm finding are:

WFXT (analog 25/DTV 31): on air at 78kW; has a permit for 1000kW.
WUNI (analog 27/DTV 29): on air at 11kW; has a permit for 165kW.

In both cases it is quite possible they are in fact on the air with the higher permitted power but just haven't completed the formalities for a permanent license.

Most Boston DTVs are on the same towers as their associated analogs.  Exceptions I see are WSBK (38/DTV39) which is on the channel 2/4/5 tower, and three smaller stations (channels 48/62/68) which share a tower in the tower farm.  (Newton, IIRC)

[w9wi]

I had the same situation here living on the plateaus of the Blue Mt. range in VA. until i found an antenna that solves most of my problems. I found this online under HDTV reception, its called a Xium parabolic with reflective ground, its a little pricey but works. Enclosed is the web address with all the info. if interested.
[url=http://www.goxium.com]www.goxium.com]

Yikes.  It actually worked?

There are cheaper ways of doing this.  I would think mounting a set of rabbit ears on the outside of your house would work better than this Xium antenna. 

The antenna is FAR too small to behave as a parabolic for VHF TV channels.  (let alone CB radio, let alone AM!)  Really, it's far too small to behave as a parabolic for UHF.  Basically as far as TV signals are concerned, it's a piece of metal that happens to be shaped like a satellite dish.  A watering can of the same size would probably work as well.  (I suppose the dish design might win some points on aesthetics, when compared to a real TV antenna)

If it didn't cost $130 it might be worth trying...

[Signpost]

Quick basic question:

Should I bother make an effort to install an old fashioned outdoor TV antenna?   
Or will the cable TV signal be all I'll ever want?

Seems like over the air HDTV reception has the potential to render a better picture than cable.    Maybe could go without cable altogether.

We live at the top of a hill - should be able to pull in everything.

[Skynet74]

Quick basic question:

Should I bother make an effort to install an old fashioned outdoor TV antenna?  
Or will the cable TV signal be all I'll ever want?

Seems like over the air HDTV reception has the potential to render a better picture than cable.    Maybe could go without cable altogether.

We live at the top of a hill - should be able to pull in everything.

    The outdoor antenna is a nice thing to have for when you want to receive out of market stations that your cable company may not carry. It's also good for if you lose your cable altogether. At least you'll have a backup antenna. If I lived on top of a hill I would not even hesitate to get an outdoor antenna. I would definitely do it. But then again I'm crazy like that. Most people probably wouldn't even use the antenna if they had cable. So it's really up to you.